Problem with People or CPALead?
2013-12-14, 04:26 PM,
#1
Hi,

Some guys are saying here that CPALead is best for French offers. Some guys saying CR is low, so they moved to new network from CPALead.

I checked Affplus.com , Same French offers are displayed in most of leading networks.

Then, Why people blame network for low CR or low EPC? Very simple, Same offers on different two networks with different CR or EPC. Means all on affiliates of that network.

Am I right or wrong? Sorry If I am wrong Smile
2013-12-14, 04:29 PM,
#2
That's a good question! I guess sometimes it comes down to the landing page and niche being offered.

That's why I always say it's so hard to judge which network will give you the best EPC/CR without trying them yourself, someone who's having success with a particular network could brag about it... then you'll try that network and it may be the case you have terrible results.

The best way to go about it is to absolutely split test!

In my opinion these networks have the best FR offers:
AdWork Media
AdScend Media
CPALead
This network is banned from CPA Elites and all discussions around it. Report this post now.(my network)

Give them all a try :)
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suthars4n(2013-12-14 04:33 PM) 
2013-12-14, 04:32 PM,
#3
I seriously doubt other networks have the same offers of 30$ or over 30$.

Not to mention that CPALead has a diversity of offers on FR, not 10-15 offers like other networks have.
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CPALead(2013-12-14 04:45 PM) 
2013-12-14, 04:45 PM,
#4
In the end, survey wise, they're all the same if you do custom. Really. The only reason for the rates difference is if you use their default content locker.
2013-12-14, 04:56 PM,
(This post was last modified: 2013-12-14, 05:04 PM by CPALead.)
#5
(2013-12-14, 04:26 PM)NY Sutharshan Wrote: Hi,

Some guys are saying here that CPALead is best for French offers. Some guys saying CR is low, so they moved to new network from CPALead.

I checked Affplus.com , Same French offers are displayed in most of leading networks.

Then, Why people blame network for low CR or low EPC? Very simple, Same offers on different two networks with different CR or EPC. Means all on affiliates of that network.

Am I right or wrong? Sorry If I am wrong Smile

I'd like to set the record straight and I'm more than happy to have any other network read this and explain to users how their rates are "better". I think affiliates deserve that kind of open approach. More to the point, you can always look at our payouts to get a bottom line




For the most part, no one is debating this as there really are some networks that just do their work and mind their own business. Others try to build their reputation off of attacking and spreading false info or trying to mislead publishers into believing something about their network (or our own) without coming out and saying it, that way when they're called out they can say they never exactly made a direct claim. I think that's non sense and not the way to do business. Be outright and the facts can stand.

I'll make it easy by coming out and saying it CPAlead is able to offer the highest payouts for one simple reason. We invented Content Locking and as such were able to get to our advertisers who are the the same advertisers out there today and negotiate exclusive contracts. Now, we also have a large advertising team (the largest in the space) who work on securing ads every single day and that definitely helps but another network could in theory hire 4-5 people to match our team's size, so that is a current advantage on top of exclusives but not one that is impossible to measure up to. Now, do we have an exclusive with every single advertiser out there? No, not at all. Do we have exclusive deals with many of them and many who also provide ads to the other networks? Yes, absolutely 100% since we all go to the same advertisers. Unless you give a NEW advertiser who pops up a huge incentive, exclusives are a thing of the past. Fortunately, CPAlead existed in the past, we were doing it in 2006 before anyone copied the Content Locker and our platform :)

In our contracts we stipulated that if there are ever other Content Locking businesses, that they cannot receive the same rate as CPAlead. It might sound a bit harsh but it was to protect our business since we realized that there would be copycats one day and there may be many. Here we are in 2013 and there have been at least 50 networks offer Content Locking.

It turned out to be a great move. Advertisers at the time had no choice since we were the only Content Locking business in town and with the threat of us walking away, why wouldn't you sign that deal. Fast forward a few years and all of the Content Locking businesses pop up just like PPD networks arise in such abundance. Anyone who pops up over night with a new network and makes a lot of claims is trying to promote themselves and I certainly can't blame them but the proof is in the earnings/payouts.

CPAlead also was able to support new advertisers. The current leader in the France FR Market who provides the majority of FR offers to ALL networks actually got their start from CPAlead. Which is why its a bit funny to hear so many people talk about their rates.

They're a company out of the Netherlands :) & for those other networks reading this, feel free to write them and ask them who gave their business the start in the CPA industry and supported them to get to where they are as the #1 FR offer provider. It was CPAlead, so naturally you can imagine the position we hold with them. & when I say start, I mean no other network supported them or allowed them to make money, we were the #1 client and only client and got them up and running.
(I imagine a few network managers will lose sleep knowing this as there's no sly reply to cover it up or mislead here. Just facts)

In terms of CR, it most certainly varies Affiliate to affiliate. There are all kinds of methods out there that people employ to various results. Some blackhat, some whitehat, some SEO, some PPC so on and so forth. Then there's the landing page which, to me, is part of the method.
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ls300(2013-12-15 12:55 AM) suthars4n(2013-12-14 05:01 PM) 

[Image: RoZnyPa.gif]
2013-12-14, 05:26 PM,
#6
(2013-12-14, 04:56 PM)CPAleadPeter Wrote:
(2013-12-14, 04:26 PM)NY Sutharshan Wrote: Hi,

Some guys are saying here that CPALead is best for French offers. Some guys saying CR is low, so they moved to new network from CPALead.

I checked Affplus.com , Same French offers are displayed in most of leading networks.

Then, Why people blame network for low CR or low EPC? Very simple, Same offers on different two networks with different CR or EPC. Means all on affiliates of that network.

Am I right or wrong? Sorry If I am wrong Smile

I'd like to set the record straight and I'm more than happy to have any other network read this and explain to users how their rates are "better". I think affiliates deserve that kind of open approach. More to the point, you can always look at our payouts to get a bottom line




For the most part, no one is debating this as there really are some networks that just do their work and mind their own business. Others try to build their reputation off of attacking and spreading false info or trying to mislead publishers into believing something about their network (or our own) without coming out and saying it, that way when they're called out they can say they never exactly made a direct claim. I think that's non sense and not the way to do business. Be outright and the facts can stand.

I'll make it easy by coming out and saying it CPAlead is able to offer the highest payouts for one simple reason. We invented Content Locking and as such were able to get to our advertisers who are the the same advertisers out there today and negotiate exclusive contracts. Now, we also have a large advertising team (the largest in the space) who work on securing ads every single day and that definitely helps but another network could in theory hire 4-5 people to match our team's size, so that is a current advantage on top of exclusives but not one that is impossible to measure up to. Now, do we have an exclusive with every single advertiser out there? No, not at all. Do we have exclusive deals with many of them and many who also provide ads to the other networks? Yes, absolutely 100% since we all go to the same advertisers. Unless you give a NEW advertiser who pops up a huge incentive, exclusives are a thing of the past. Fortunately, CPAlead existed in the past, we were doing it in 2006 before anyone copied the Content Locker and our platform :)

In our contracts we stipulated that if there are ever other Content Locking businesses, that they cannot receive the same rate as CPAlead. It might sound a bit harsh but it was to protect our business since we realized that there would be copycats one day and there may be many. Here we are in 2013 and there have been at least 50 networks offer Content Locking.

It turned out to be a great move. Advertisers at the time had no choice since we were the only Content Locking business in town and with the threat of us walking away, why wouldn't you sign that deal. Fast forward a few years and all of the Content Locking businesses pop up just like PPD networks arise in such abundance. Anyone who pops up over night with a new network and makes a lot of claims is trying to promote themselves and I certainly can't blame them but the proof is in the earnings/payouts.

CPAlead also was able to support new advertisers. The current leader in the France FR Market who provides the majority of FR offers to ALL networks actually got their start from CPAlead. Which is why its a bit funny to hear so many people talk about their rates.

They're a company out of the Netherlands :) & for those other networks reading this, feel free to write them and ask them who gave their business the start in the CPA industry and supported them to get to where they are as the #1 FR offer provider. It was CPAlead, so naturally you can imagine the position we hold with them. & when I say start, I mean no other network supported them or allowed them to make money, we were the #1 client and only client and got them up and running.
(I imagine a few network managers will lose sleep knowing this as there's no sly reply to cover it up or mislead here. Just facts)

In terms of CR, it most certainly varies Affiliate to affiliate. There are all kinds of methods out there that people employ to various results. Some blackhat, some whitehat, some SEO, some PPC so on and so forth. Then there's the landing page which, to me, is part of the method.

Guys, most CPA networks can have those high paying FR offers, but they don't like to run them as they are SCRUB offers, therefore most cpa networks provide you with non-scrub offers which have a bit lower payout but Higher conversion rate.

Peter, we all know that your network invented content locking, please just chill out and no need to repeat the same line over and over again.
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Alek(2014-03-27 02:02 AM) WaltD(2013-12-14 05:27 PM) 
2013-12-14, 06:10 PM,
(This post was last modified: 2013-12-14, 06:14 PM by MrMaster.)
#7
French PIN Submit/Mobile offers are quite complex. For instance offers in France from the market leader (not sure if there is some kind of bad juju if you mention them by name) which Peter mentions about have a lot of flows.

I will give an example, the offers I see in the $28-31 range is a bunch of BlinkoGold offers. We have a few of these where I work.

This type of offer is called a 1 week SCRUB.
The initial conversion rate of this offer should not actually be much lower from an organic offer standpoint(how nice/attractive the offer is to the end user). However the offer supplier gives us (the network) a list of reversals before the payment cycle for the leads that did not reach the offer conversion requirements, in this case "A Scrub will take place if the user unsubscribes within a week after service subscription". This of course will result in a end lower CR for the offer at the end of the month cycle although tbh the drop in CR vs the lower paying offers is not huge, 0.5-1.5% in most cases.

Now like I was saying, FR offers are quite complex. In addition to the 1 week SCRUB there are a lot of lower paying offers that have the same title because the advertiser wants to cover all flow types
these flows include:
5 Minute SCRUB (typically the $20-23 range), A organised and accepted SCRUB but at a much faster rate.

ISP-Flow No SCRUB and No SCRUB (typically below the $20 range), these offers don't have an organised and accepted SCRUB however as a fully qualified "Offer Wizard" at a network I can guarantee that I will still receive a list of leads that need reversing from the advertiser/source network.

Typically the CR of those types of offers will be higher at the end of the month but like I said before not by a great deal, they are FR PINS after all.

So in the end what really dictates it is how the network operates. Is the network using proper french titles on the locker, is it poorly translated, how good is the locker customization, is the network using preferential algorithms for high margin offers? All these things and more come into effect when it comes to this kind of thing and the only thing I can say is sign up to a bunch of networks and see what works best for you.

The market place is highly competitive now, no longer is there a monopoly and this creates healthy competition which I think is great. Personally it makes my job a lot more interesting and I get a buzz from trying to beat the offers our competitors have.

Hope this goes part way to explain the FR PIN offer ecosystem.

-Will
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apladas(2013-12-15 12:14 AM) 
2013-12-14, 11:44 PM,
#8
(2013-12-14, 05:09 PM)IncentLockSam Wrote: However you do seem to keep going around using this whole "we invented content locking" quote. Sure, you invented something.. congratulations on that!

But if you've ever watched the movie Social Network, you'll realise inventing something means absolutely nothing.

I have had a niche stolen from me before and it was not a good experience. I dont know what i would do if someone stole an idea from me and told me its okay because scummy people in the movies do it.

Are you going to copy cpaelites next and tell the owner its okay because it was in the movies? how about the niches of your publishers? What is wrong with you? Have some class you sound like a jerk. Would not trust your company ever. not with my niche or even your advice.
2013-12-14, 11:52 PM,
#9
When you comment on this thread, you should have a businessman mindset. Not just PPD noobs crap mentality.

Just saying. :)
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WaltD(2013-12-15 12:04 AM) 
2013-12-14, 11:59 PM,
#10
(2013-12-14, 11:44 PM)intrusion Wrote:
(2013-12-14, 05:09 PM)IncentLockSam Wrote: However you do seem to keep going around using this whole "we invented content locking" quote. Sure, you invented something.. congratulations on that!

But if you've ever watched the movie Social Network, you'll realise inventing something means absolutely nothing.

I have had a niche stolen from me before and it was not a good experience. I dont know what i would do if someone stole an idea from me and told me its okay because scummy people in the movies do it.

Are you going to copy cpaelites next and tell the owner its okay because it was in the movies? how about the niches of your publishers? What is wrong with you? Have some class you sound like a jerk. Would not trust your company ever. not with my niche or even your advice.

It's unfortunate you see things that way. I'm simply stating a fact, innovation is what drives superior products in any industry.

The Wright Brothers invented the first airplane, does that mean that the Boeing 747 isn't better than it? Does it also mean that the Airbus A380 isn't better than that? Boeing didn't go around afterwards claiming that "Hey, we created the first super jumbo jet... therefore it's the best jumbo jet!!" they decided to innovate and came up with the 787.

Another example could be Nokia, they were the true innovators of mobile phones in the early 2000s. Who didn't have a Nokia, right? Doesn't mean Apple couldn't come along and create a much better product. Did Nokia then go around saying "Hey, we create the first mobile phone therefore our product is superior now!" No they didn't!

Like I said in my original post, nothing against CPALead. Peter is a great guy I'm sure and I actually have working relationships with some of the people who user to work there: John Byrant for example is a fantastic guy and still works in this industry.

You can't call someone a jerk for wanting to innovate or offer a competing service because at the end of the day without competition companies would become complacent and you'd have terrible service, poor rates etc. Competition is good and I for one am happy I have so many sites to compete against; it drives me to work harder for my publishers. It's competition that makes me get up earlier and go to bed later, that makes me fly all over the World to attend industry events etc.

Hope you understand and don't take this the wrong way :)
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Alek(2014-03-27 02:18 AM) finnishhacker(2013-12-31 05:11 PM) ThinkableWeb(2013-12-15 12:18 AM) KFC(2013-12-15 12:16 AM) apladas(2013-12-15 12:14 AM) MrMaster(2013-12-15 12:13 AM) 


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